- cross-posted to:
- worldnews@lemmy.ml
- cross-posted to:
- worldnews@lemmy.ml
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“Appears to show” like it’s not a video and not something that happens every day.
But it does appear that way. And they probably didn’t get any “real” confirmation that the video is real.
I get it, I just think it’s a bit weasel-y when people describe video footage that way. Like were they provoked? Did they kill one? It’s not that complicated.
Israel said they were “kneeling to light a Molotov cocktail” and so it wasn’t unprovoked. Problems are a) no Molotov cocktail in the clip and b) they shot someone else first, not the person kneeling. So let’s put on our fucking Sherlock hats and solve this mystery oh wow I wonder whatever could have happened
a careful cut or edit, could make all the difference.
given that the video is specifically presented as ‘unprovoked’ i’m going to guess it wasn’t.
Hi. Friendly local combat vet here. This was absolutely murder. Nobody is visibly carrying weapons and the kneeling guy isn’t doing anything from the kneeling position. If he had a Molotov he’d have to come up with it to throw it. Which gives any trained soldier with their gun up and ready an eternity to shoot him. Furthermore there’s no reason to shoot at the others. The volley of bullets is absolutely too much force for what might be one guy, away from the group. Operating procedures for infantry are pretty clear for this, the soldier that spots the possible threat stays on it until told otherwise and the squad leader either has confidence in him or calls for his best shooter to take over.
It’s impossible for us to know if this is a training problem, a command climate problem, or a straight up murder problem, but it takes a lot of de-humanization, hate, or fear to shoot at unarmed people. All of which are supposed to be tightly controlled by leaders. For example we drew the line at carrying weapons in 2003. If you had a weapon and weren’t actively surrendering, you were a “target” not a person. Until someone picked up a weapon though they were people deserving of our best efforts to protect them and speed them away from the combat area.
The IDF in no way meets these standards. For that alone they should be shamed and embargoed.
What country are you from? I respect your perspective and thoughtfulness. I really appreciate you spending the effort on this comment.
The US. And yeah I’m aware that even at our best we had failures.
You’d think the 99% of posters that descend from European genocidal countries or colonisers, would cut us some slack for seeing our own warts, but it’s easier to hate us and those of us stuck with the shit parts
It’s impossible for us to know if this is a training problem, a command climate problem, or a straight up murder problem,
From this video? Yes. From the fact that the IDF is currently committing honest to God genocide, it’s the latter.
Oh I’m not talking about a training deficit for this one squad. I’m talking force wide. One way to commit war crimes is to just never train scenarios with civilians. Train that everything not in a friendly uniform is a threat. Notably command climate is also a war crime. That’s why we hung the Nazi officers who tried to say they never “ordered” any crimes, even though there was massive evidence of crimes being committed.
There’s no
screenshotscenario where this isn’t a war crime. It’s just a matter of how deep the rot goes. I’m sorry I wasn’t clear about that.Edited because of Google Autocorrect. Left because it’s funny in an absurdist millennial kind of way.
Yeah in that case I’m going to guess Israel was torturing innocents just out of shot. Since we can just ignore the video and believe what we want
Looks like the soldier was far away from them, and they weren’t even looking in his direction. What could they have done to provoke him? And why did he shoot the person who came back to help later?
Let your imagination run wild and lets see what you can come up with.
Given that the video is specifically presented as ‘unprovoked’ i’m going to guess it wasn’t.
Yeah, because your aversion to declarative headlines changes the fact that IDF does that all the fucking time 🙄
“An IDF spokesperson said he was kneeling to light a molotov”
Every single word in there is a lie. Wow.
Nader told the AP that the object was a stack of cardboard boxes and scraps of paper that 17-year-old Osaid Rimawi had gathered and was preparing to light to keep the men warm.
Pretty fucked up
Aljazeera also just released this video of the IDF Nazis shooting civilians fleeing on the “safe route” https://youtu.be/qGsy2xTXpfY
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
https://piped.video/qGsy2xTXpfY
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I’m open-source; check me out at GitHub.
This is the best summary I could come up with:
The fatal shooting in the village of Beit Rima last week is the latest in a series of incidents in which soldiers appeared to fire without provocation, a trend Palestinians say has worsened since the outbreak of the Israel-Hamas war in Gaza three months ago.
After reviewing the footage, a military spokesperson said soldiers reported that one of the Palestinians — visible kneeling in front of an object just outside the frame — was igniting a Molotov cocktail when he was shot.
Nader told the AP that the object was a stack of cardboard boxes and scraps of paper that 17-year-old Osaid Rimawi had gathered and was preparing to light to keep the men warm.
Other videos of the shooting posted to social media and reviewed by AP appear consistent with Nader’s description of the object Osaid was preparing to light.
Human rights groups have previously presented cases in which soldiers opened fire without their lives being in danger, in apparent violation of the military’s rules of engagement.
The Hamas attack prompted Israel to wage a blistering air and ground campaign on the Gaza Strip that has killed over 23,000 people — and to tighten its grip on the West Bank through near-nightly, often deadly, raids.
The original article contains 1,313 words, the summary contains 206 words. Saved 84%. I’m a bot and I’m open source!
Appears?
At the extreme left of the video you can see a man in the middle of the road kneel down to light something on fire. The men contend that it was a pile of cardboard they wanted to burn for warmth. The Israeli’s counter that it was a Molotov cocktail.
It doesn’t look like a Molotov cocktail, but personally I don’t buy the “warmth” story. Who lights cardboard on fire in the street for warmth? I think a far more likely scenario, given the men knew Israeli soldiers were nearby and didn’t leave while others did, is that they were attempting to show some resistance by burning shit. This pissed off the Israeli’s, who shot at them.
Seems like murder given the lack of an immediate threat.
Who lights cardboard on fire in the street for warmth?
People who got everything they have taken away from them, apparently 🙄
These people have houses mate. Watch the video for proof.
Not even the homeless would burn scrap cardboard/paper in an uncontained little pile in the middle of the street. That would provide next to zero warmth and would require the person to sit in the middle of the street.
Not even the homeless in US could compare to Gaza. Also, just because you see someone still has a home, doesn’t mean everyone does. The ones that do don’t want to set it on fire. Wait, you don’t think they have functional proper heating in there, do you?
This wasn’t in Gaza, and the interview is done in the wounded man’s house. Read first, then virtue signal.
Are you saying West Bank is much better than Gaza?
What is your point, exactly? A bunch of people lighting bonfire on the ruins of their own hometown deserve to get shot?
… I said it looked like murder. There’s just no satisfying you people. And for the record the West Bank is much better off than Gaza.
The desert is pretty cold at night. Lighting trash on fire for warmth is credible.
Not that anything justifies killing, but were they trying to set something on fire? Again, this would not justify anything.
Cardboard. For warmth. Because the Israeli government has taken away the electricity and fuel they’d otherwise use.
don’t light fires when the nazguls are about
Yes - a pile of something in the middle of the road.
The youths said it was a pile of cardboard and paper to help keep them warm. Admittedly, it was around 10°C (50°F) over the last few nights at 2am.
As others have said, a like of wood and paper form warmth. The important part though is the person kneeling to light that on fire was not shot first, someone else standing nearby was killed. Then two other people running to the victims aid where then shot. When one of those guys trys to crawl away he gets shot again. Then when the IDF troops get there, they don’t seem to give a shit about the pile of wood/paper, they just look at they guy they killed, kick one of the wounded guys on the ground, and then leave without providing any aid.
The IDF’s story is they thought the guy lighting the pile was lighting a moltov cocktail. Bullshit, but even if so, why not shoot that guy doing the lighting instead of just some other random nearby guy? Or how do the guys coming to the first guys aid pose any kind of threat?
What’s really fucked is nothing will come of this. Just another dead Palestinian.
Jesus I couldn’t bring myself to keep watching. They didn’t have their medic provide aid? That’s a war crime all on it’s own.
They didn’t have their medic provide aid?
Why would you help the guy you explicitly, unprovokedly tried to kill?
In a normal engagement (as normal as combat gets at any rate) you would absolutely provide aid, even to enemy fighters. Once you get up to them and they’re out of combat you’re responsible for them under international law.
No no I meant: These people weren’t in combat and were shot anyway. Intentionally. The monsters who shot them wanted them dead, so it makes a sick kind of sense that they wouldn’t provide them aid after the fact.
Yeah, it does. It definitely puts the cap on any question as to their motives.
Deserts get really cold at night, especially in the winter.
