Yeah it’s really strange. I’m not a fan of MS by any means, but I’ve found myself making so many pro-MS comments on Lemmy just because the userbase leans so heavily pro-Linux and anti-MS.
And then getting downvoted by people who just disagree with your opinion. I’m one of the Reddit refugees so I don’t know if we brought that with us or Lemmy was like that before but it’s sad to see.
That’s why downvote buttons exist? If you want to express your opinion on the internet, go ahead, but you should be prepared for the possibility that it might not be a popular opinion.
Downvote buttons are meant to be used for comments that don’t contribute to the discussion or are plainly completely wrong, not for opinions you disagree with. But most people can’t stand being disagreed with on things they feel passionately about, so they will still downvote where they merely disagree.
My take: Upvote the stuff other people should see. Downvote the stuff that should have never been here at all. You don’t have to agree or disagree, you can even have no opinion. But if you find it worthwhile to others, upvote it. Detrimental, downvote it.
MS has a history which informs what their fututre actions are likely to be. If you can’t believe the comments here perhaps you have not heard that history. If you have then consider that lemmy is free software and so you’re more likely to find that way of thinking here.
There’s not a single reference on that page that’s less than 20 years old. Yes, Microsoft did some anticompetitive stuff back when Bill Gates was CEO, but it’s absurd to suggest that that still “informs what their future actions are likely to be”. A lot has changed since the 1990s.
What has changed which means they should be forgiven or trusted during these 20 years? What does a Linux subsystem for Windows prove? They want users to run Linux apps in Windows so their users will be less tempted to not use Windows… so they can add more anti features for profit.
I guess you are completely unaware of the fact that a huge chunk of the Azure infrastructure runs on linux now. MS also knows that in the enterprise space, companies use linux in their server infrastructure also, so their employees need to be able to work in linx as well. MS has versions of SQL and I believe also exchange that run on linux. WSL isn’t just about appease neckbeard wannabes.
I don’t understand why MS using Linux gives you trust in MS. MS leaked documents (over 20 years ago too) showed they considered free software a serious competitior (including Linux). Makes sense they would use it, so what?
I was working in the industry like I do now when that happened. I was disappointed the antitrust trial didn’t break up MS into three companies. Things have changed there. I guess we should dig into your past and hold everything you’ve did 20 years ago against you?
Ballmer was the driving force behind that mentality and he’s been gone from MS for a very long time.
Would breaking up big tech software companies have the same effect as it does with regular companies? I can’t shake the idea it won’t really work. People don’t want the 2nd best free (gratis) mapping software.
I guess we should dig into your past and hold everything you’ve did 20 years ago against you?
If one has not tried to sincerely make amends or doesn’t appear to have changed then it’s resonable take past actions into consideration?? I still see Microsoft making anti-consumer moves and they ain’t making Windows free software (free as in freedom).
A broken clock can be right twice a day. Unless someone keeps playing with the dials.
As a former user, and an hardcore fanboy, I loved MS and Windows. They made computers accessible for the general public. The OS and the office suite were great. The sheer amount of available software for it was phenomenal. They even decided to publish games, which meant quality!
Until they decided to break things.
XP was a great OS, Vista wasn’t. Then 7 was back to being good just for 8 to be not as good. Then Cortana and Edge and the push for cloud computing.
What worked, worked well and was actually useful was changed, removed, phased out…
GNU/Linux is not without its dramas and difficulties but we can expect a good degree of continuity between each version of a software (I’m looking a you, Gnome!). And if we’re that hell bent on having that specific specific piece of software or OS setup, well, we can.
MS by contrast just chucks the good things out and doesn’t even let them floating around as something users may add to their system.
Unpopular opinion: Vista was actually a good step forward, but the hardware of the time wasn’t up for the task which made it run like dogshit, and hence the public perception. It brought in better memory management, and UAC for better security among other things.
What worked, worked well and was actually useful was changed, removed, phased out…
MS by contrast just chucks the good things out and doesn’t even let them floating around as something users may add to their system.
Cortana, widely hated and unused, was phased out for one… wordpad being gone is so insignificant, it wasn’t even very good at its primary task.
They often replace things, e.g. the Photos app had a Video editor built in but now that’s a separate and better app. I think they’re doing a pretty good job of their software range actually.
What bugs me about Windows is actually their striving so much for backwards compatibility that there’s at least 6 ways to edit things or data and they’re all still officially supported. It’s a bit bloaty and no Devs have any consensus.
Does someone remembers the PowerToys collection?
The newer version is installed on my Windows 11 and is under active development.
Vista was a good idea and good start, but 7 was the finished product that needed shipped. Just like XP was the finished version of 2000, though 2000 wasn’t bad, but XP was just better, more optimized, and yes hardware caught up also. 98, was 95 but better, fixed and polished. 10 was windows 8 better, fixed and polished, and they dumped that stupid fucking tablet interface that everyone hated, (and whoever put that interface in server 2012 needs to be beaten with a sand filled wiffle ball bat)
Backwards compatibility is why windows dominates the market. Without that, it wouldn’t have taken over the business world. Legacy code is what makes the business world operate. Yes it hold back windows for some growth, but deprecating that would wreck so many businesses, especially small ones.
That name rings a bell. My username is from “Tweak Tools 95”, which I think was a part of that or something.
Edit: Also Windows has a long history of alternating good and bad versions.
98 - good
ME - bad
XP - good
Vista - bad
7 - good
8 - bad
10 - good
11 - bad
In theory, the next version of Windows should be fairly good, or at least an improvement on 11. However I worry that MS will buck the trend now - particularly as they’ve pivoted away from software sales to software as a service (with additional data collection because fuck paying users).
Unpopular opinion: Win 11 works well for me, and is visually better than Win 10. Although it’s a fairly recent PC. Although if they keep pushing more telemetry and ads, I’m moving over to Ubuntu.
Its the small things on Windows 11 for me. Like the “more options” section on the right click… that must have been added just to annoy people. It’s where all the good options are.
That’s a big issue for me, though. I really value being able to do simple tasks quickly with minimal effort and the fewest clicks, it allows me to focus my attention on the actual thing I’m trying to do. Clicking through multiple submenus unnecessarily infuriates me.
As someone from a developing country, windows 11 contributes to higher digital inequality because of its unnecessary high hardware requirements. If they don’t support windows 10 for a long time, we will suffer a great toll.
And unfortunately, people around here barely use linux and developed quite a repulsion for it, which only makes things worse for ourselves…
It’s hard not to hate microsoft when we live on the ugly side of capitalism.
I would have never thought so many people would be pissed about Wordpad. Fucking Wordpad! It’s terrible! And Ms isn’t killing it to get office subscriptions because no one fucking uses it! They’re killing it because it isn’t worth the effort to maintain. There are so many free alternatives that are better.
I can count on one hand the amount of MS products I’ve vaguely enjoyed using. Most things seems to be designed with the attitude that people will be using this whether they like it or not, making the user experience fucking awful. Nothing wrong with shitting on them.
This place really hates MS. Can’t believe some of the comments here.
Yeah it’s really strange. I’m not a fan of MS by any means, but I’ve found myself making so many pro-MS comments on Lemmy just because the userbase leans so heavily pro-Linux and anti-MS.
Lemmy and other Fediverse sites tend to attract folks who prefer FOSS. Early Reddit was that way too!
It’s not just preferring FOSS, though – it’s as if people have to publicly perform their hatred of Microsoft.
thats what anger does usually
Pillorying Microsoft has been a FOSS tradition for decades
It shouldn’t be that strange. Linux nerds are a huge Lemmy demographic.
Much more up on new technology, FOSS, and privacy issues etc. than the general population. Good fit for Lemmy.
And then getting downvoted by people who just disagree with your opinion. I’m one of the Reddit refugees so I don’t know if we brought that with us or Lemmy was like that before but it’s sad to see.
That’s why downvote buttons exist? If you want to express your opinion on the internet, go ahead, but you should be prepared for the possibility that it might not be a popular opinion.
It’s just that it’s boring. I’d rather have an interesting debate. Downvoting everything you simply disagree with just leads to groupthink forums.
Those downvotes aren’t stopping you from having a discussion. They’re just hurting your pride.
Downvote buttons are meant to be used for comments that don’t contribute to the discussion or are plainly completely wrong, not for opinions you disagree with. But most people can’t stand being disagreed with on things they feel passionately about, so they will still downvote where they merely disagree.
You might need to brush up on the difference between theory and practice.
No (and not downvoted) … it’s about controlling visibility.
https://join-lemmy.org/docs/users/03-votes-and-ranking.html
My take: Upvote the stuff other people should see. Downvote the stuff that should have never been here at all. You don’t have to agree or disagree, you can even have no opinion. But if you find it worthwhile to others, upvote it. Detrimental, downvote it.
Maybe there should be four buttons:
Which could be used for more filtering options.
Or maybe a separate agreement/disagree metric. I wouldn’t mind seeing the consensus on a topic separate from the measure of usefulness.
MS has a history which informs what their fututre actions are likely to be. If you can’t believe the comments here perhaps you have not heard that history. If you have then consider that lemmy is free software and so you’re more likely to find that way of thinking here.
My goto for distrust of MS https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embrace,_extend,_and_extinguish
deleted by creator
There’s not a single reference on that page that’s less than 20 years old. Yes, Microsoft did some anticompetitive stuff back when Bill Gates was CEO, but it’s absurd to suggest that that still “informs what their future actions are likely to be”. A lot has changed since the 1990s.
What has changed which means they should be forgiven or trusted during these 20 years? What does a Linux subsystem for Windows prove? They want users to run Linux apps in Windows so their users will be less tempted to not use Windows… so they can add more anti features for profit.
I guess you are completely unaware of the fact that a huge chunk of the Azure infrastructure runs on linux now. MS also knows that in the enterprise space, companies use linux in their server infrastructure also, so their employees need to be able to work in linx as well. MS has versions of SQL and I believe also exchange that run on linux. WSL isn’t just about appease neckbeard wannabes.
I don’t understand why MS using Linux gives you trust in MS. MS leaked documents (over 20 years ago too) showed they considered free software a serious competitior (including Linux). Makes sense they would use it, so what?
I was working in the industry like I do now when that happened. I was disappointed the antitrust trial didn’t break up MS into three companies. Things have changed there. I guess we should dig into your past and hold everything you’ve did 20 years ago against you?
Ballmer was the driving force behind that mentality and he’s been gone from MS for a very long time.
Would breaking up big tech software companies have the same effect as it does with regular companies? I can’t shake the idea it won’t really work. People don’t want the 2nd best free (gratis) mapping software.
If one has not tried to sincerely make amends or doesn’t appear to have changed then it’s resonable take past actions into consideration?? I still see Microsoft making anti-consumer moves and they ain’t making Windows free software (free as in freedom).
Apple is a LOT worse than Microsoft these days
Not to mention the amount of people who think this is about notepad.
A broken clock can be right twice a day. Unless someone keeps playing with the dials.
As a former user, and an hardcore fanboy, I loved MS and Windows. They made computers accessible for the general public. The OS and the office suite were great. The sheer amount of available software for it was phenomenal. They even decided to publish games, which meant quality!
Until they decided to break things.
XP was a great OS, Vista wasn’t. Then 7 was back to being good just for 8 to be not as good. Then Cortana and Edge and the push for cloud computing.
What worked, worked well and was actually useful was changed, removed, phased out…
GNU/Linux is not without its dramas and difficulties but we can expect a good degree of continuity between each version of a software (I’m looking a you, Gnome!). And if we’re that hell bent on having that specific specific piece of software or OS setup, well, we can.
MS by contrast just chucks the good things out and doesn’t even let them floating around as something users may add to their system.
Does someone remembers the PowerToys collection?
PowerToys is very much live and available for download. I use it daily.
PowerToys is alive and well, and updated regularly. More features now too.
PowerToys:
https://apps.microsoft.com/store/detail/microsoft-powertoys/XP89DCGQ3K6VLD
https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/powertoys/
Unpopular opinion: Vista was actually a good step forward, but the hardware of the time wasn’t up for the task which made it run like dogshit, and hence the public perception. It brought in better memory management, and UAC for better security among other things.
They often replace things, e.g. the Photos app had a Video editor built in but now that’s a separate and better app. I think they’re doing a pretty good job of their software range actually.
What bugs me about Windows is actually their striving so much for backwards compatibility that there’s at least 6 ways to edit things or data and they’re all still officially supported. It’s a bit bloaty and no Devs have any consensus.
The newer version is installed on my Windows 11 and is under active development.
Vista was a good idea and good start, but 7 was the finished product that needed shipped. Just like XP was the finished version of 2000, though 2000 wasn’t bad, but XP was just better, more optimized, and yes hardware caught up also. 98, was 95 but better, fixed and polished. 10 was windows 8 better, fixed and polished, and they dumped that stupid fucking tablet interface that everyone hated, (and whoever put that interface in server 2012 needs to be beaten with a sand filled wiffle ball bat)
Backwards compatibility is why windows dominates the market. Without that, it wouldn’t have taken over the business world. Legacy code is what makes the business world operate. Yes it hold back windows for some growth, but deprecating that would wreck so many businesses, especially small ones.
That name rings a bell. My username is from “Tweak Tools 95”, which I think was a part of that or something.
Edit: Also Windows has a long history of alternating good and bad versions.
In theory, the next version of Windows should be fairly good, or at least an improvement on 11. However I worry that MS will buck the trend now - particularly as they’ve pivoted away from software sales to software as a service (with additional data collection because fuck paying users).
Unpopular opinion: Win 11 works well for me, and is visually better than Win 10. Although it’s a fairly recent PC. Although if they keep pushing more telemetry and ads, I’m moving over to Ubuntu.
Its the small things on Windows 11 for me. Like the “more options” section on the right click… that must have been added just to annoy people. It’s where all the good options are.
Otherwise, seems to run fine.
That’s a big issue for me, though. I really value being able to do simple tasks quickly with minimal effort and the fewest clicks, it allows me to focus my attention on the actual thing I’m trying to do. Clicking through multiple submenus unnecessarily infuriates me.
As someone from a developing country, windows 11 contributes to higher digital inequality because of its unnecessary high hardware requirements. If they don’t support windows 10 for a long time, we will suffer a great toll.
And unfortunately, people around here barely use linux and developed quite a repulsion for it, which only makes things worse for ourselves…
It’s hard not to hate microsoft when we live on the ugly side of capitalism.
Why does everyone keep forgetting 2000 and 8.1?
2000 was mostly NT and business stuff (which later became XP), and 8.1 by definition isn’t really a new version.
Actually, 8.1 is, or at least they market it like a new version just like Windows 7.
I mean, not many people are in the loving Microsoft camp. Tolerate maybe.
I’m guessing you’re pretty young, then.
I would have never thought so many people would be pissed about Wordpad. Fucking Wordpad! It’s terrible! And Ms isn’t killing it to get office subscriptions because no one fucking uses it! They’re killing it because it isn’t worth the effort to maintain. There are so many free alternatives that are better.
I can count on one hand the amount of MS products I’ve vaguely enjoyed using. Most things seems to be designed with the attitude that people will be using this whether they like it or not, making the user experience fucking awful. Nothing wrong with shitting on them.