'Murica is a broken country
There’s a reason why the civilised world sneers at it
There are many places where people must pay for healthcare. See, for example, parents dancing in China to raise funds to treat their children’s diseases
You say China but you replied to:
the civilised world
There are
But the predatory and cruelty of the 'Murican system is particularly egregious
Wtf happened to these comments. Holy shit
right? did someone do a thought crime? let us see shit
Probably something I said that upset some stupid 'Murican and kicked off from there
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Your boss: Well you used up all 12 weeks of your unpaid FMLA getting that little guy to all his cancer treatments, and you can only do that once every 5 years. But you still have 12 hours of PTO accrued and of course there’s our generous bereavement benefit of 16 unpaid hours. So, please, take all the time you need to recover from this, up to the 28 hours of leave time available. In these troubling times, remember that CCT Logistics in there for you, we’re family after all.
At one of the best companies I ever worked for, we had an employee who unexpectedly lost his sister with whom he was very close. I never got the full story, but it was sudden and tragic.
H.R. and his manager sat down with him when he went on extended leave to go over the over the policy for how much time he could take and then basically told him “fuck the policy, take all the time you need and let us know when you’re ready to come back.”
I really liked that company until private equity ruined it.
Can’t have capital and nice things.
Tell that to our billionaire overseers.
The shit thing is that the American healthcare system is designed to put the blame on the healthcare providers and not the politician, hospital administrators, private healthcare networks, and insurance companies that actually control the cost of healthcare. Media like this just reinforces this and errodes what little public trust we still have with the providers.
I am a provider specializing in orthopedics and rehabilitation, and I have literally no ability to tell you how much my care cost, or how much money the hospital is making from my own labour. That’s unless I break the law and just treat you for free and write the appointment down as a consultation, which I do as much as I can get away with.
Healthcare doesn’t pay the way it used to, very few specialties make an obsesne amount of money compared to the time you spend on education, and the time you spend at work. If your goal is to make a lot of money, there are a lot easier fields of study with much higher returns than healthcare.
Most physicians nowadays make slave wages until they are 30, even longer if you do a fellowship. Then you spend another decade paying off your student loans. Most physicians graduating now won’t really make anything until their 40s, and so you have about 20 years if you don’t burn out to make enough to one day retire. At the peak of their career in your 40s, the average MD is pulling in 250-300k and working 55-60 or more hours a week at a hospital. Meanwhile a person with an MBA is making more with a master’s degree with a 9-5 at a bank.
which i do as much as I can get away with
You’re playing the hero in basically every medical TV show
You would be surprised how frequently healthcare providers do this. We are more aware of the outrageous expense of healthcare than just about anyone, and most of us know exactly why.
When the United CEO got shot it was a bizarre day. There were senior pediatric physicians making jokes during work meanings about a dude getting gunned down and everyone was pretty jolly about it regardless of political leanings.
The shit thing is that the American healthcare system is designed to put the blame on the healthcare providers and not the politician, hospital administrators, private healthcare networks, and insurance companies that actually control the cost of healthcare.
America is the one who invented tipping culture.
it was always all about shifting the blame off of upper managment who do nothing, paynothing while they rake it in
but then what did we honestly expect of a country designed by slave owners.
America is the one who invented tipping culture.
And absolutely don’t sleep on the fact that tipping was implemented as a way to not pay former slaves working in restaurants.
Always amused me (not in the funny way) how hard some people fight for literal slave wages
My other half and I have been dealing with an elderly family member recently, and the amount of intentional stupidity and obtuseness on the part of the people on the money side of the problem is breathtaking.
Yeah, getting a straight answer from the billing department even for providers is super frustrating. A lot of it is because hospital networks and private insurance companies have secretive reimbursement contracts that they don’t want providers or patients to have access too.
It’s not just getting a straight answer, its getting the same answer twice from the same person that seems to be too hard.
Yeah, same thing here. A good practice is to write the date and time of the call, who you’re speaking to, and the calls reference number. I will usually summarize what we discuss and then repeat the information back to them.
If you have all that information you can usually hold them to what they told you.
That’s what we have to do. Even then they play stupid.
Well, I know in my hospital the first step would be to complain to the clinic manager. They can usually act as a go between for you and the billing department.
If that doesn’t work, pretty much every hospital has some kind of patient advocacy department. Ours is a third party called the Joint Commission for Quality and Ethics, they actually do it for a lot of hospital networks. You could register a complaint to them and back it by saying you plan to register a complaint directly to CMS if it’s not resolved. Even if you don’t have Medicare, if the hospital accepts Medicare they have to follow CMS Guidelines, which include protection concerning accurate billing.
This will make the alarms go off and probably cause an internal face to face meeting between the provider, management, and the billing department. So it’s kind of a big gun to reach for if your problem isn’t very large.
And if you’re dealing with a nursing home instead of a hospital?
You sound like a good person. Don’t let the system wear you down!
Thanks, I do my best! I’m lucky enough to work at a children’s hospital, so that helps in the morale department.
I just wanted to say that this cartoon needed doctors to visually work. It would not have been as effective to have a “hospital administrator” name tag on a random person listening to the dude lament his dead son. Like the joke doesnt work as well in that way.
Maybe have one doctor and one suit, with the suit asking the question? Make it clear that the doctor is there for medical reasons and the suit is an obnoxious parasite that had no business being involved at all.
thats why MDs, MED SCHOOL is a rich person career or at least well off. disadvantaged students often stayed disadvantaged, unless they somehow got thier md from another country.
even nursing with less schooling can make bank by being a travelling nurse, and tech workers.
every other health job, is either underpaid or just above 100k year with significant requirements like rad tech, cls, pharmacy, and health technicians are the most “taken advantaged of” jobs.
When you really get down to it, it’s the people who vote against single-payer who are to blame. The insurance companies are acting in their own self-interest, and the politicians simply represent the people who voted for them.
the politicians simply represent the people who voted for them.
If only…
Eh… Yes and no. The capital side of medicine wouldn’t be spending the big bucks to influence the media and politicians if it didn’t work.
Well, sort of.
What the research on oligarchy in America shows is that the interests of the wealthy become policy on a pretty reliable basis, but the interests of the general population typically only become policy when it does not conflict with the goals of the ownership class. This highlights that, while politicians may be responsive to their constituents at times, they are reliably responsive to the interests of their funders.
So you’re right that people that vote against the advancement of single payer and universal healthcare proposals are to blame for their ignorance; but it is also true that the for-profit healthcare industry is deeply entrenched and perpetuated across our socioeconomic system because it serves the interests of the ownership class.
If your goal is to make a lot of money, there are a lot easier fields of study with much higher returns than healthcare.
Cosmetic surgery, for one.
… cosmetic surgeons are still medical doctors, so they have the same insane schooling/residency requirements as everyone else. Plus, they have a purpose in a hospital in helping to plan surgeries to reduce the appearance of scars. It’s not just vanity, my dude.
Chiropractor, though, that’s a “medical” field that has no actual resemblance to medicine or the massive debt burden therein. Plus, they’re a joke to begin with. Much better punchline.
Dentistry is the one that is still legitimately in medicine that makes money. the difference is in the liability insurance.
I can’t fucking believe how health insurance is not good enough to cover my mandatory bones AND my luxury bones. Fukkin racket…
doesnt that still require you to become an MD, and the cost and competitiveness to become one is still there.
Yeah, they do. Read up.
Definitely on the higher end of medicine, but I’m still not sure if it’s really going to be a higher pay off than someone with an MBA. You still have nearly 20 years of school, residency, and fellowship before you start making any money.
There are only around 7500 cosmetic surgeons practicing in the US, compare that to almost half a million investment bankers… I’m pretty sure you’re going to have an easier time pulling in a million a year in banking than in surgery.
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We aren’t talking about the average MBA, I specified an investment banker, most of which have an MBA. There are just a lot more people and positions for someone with an MBA.
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I wasn’t comparing it with your average MD, I was specifically comparing it with one of the highest paid specialists in the field…
are you one of those shitty doctors who only likes the statistics when they make them look good
No, just someone who is more skilled at reading comprehension and retention than you.
No, just someone who is more skilled at reading comprehension and retention than you.
Sure, but how’s your handwriting?
I’m pretty sure you’re going to have an easier time pulling in a million a year in banking than in surgery.
Not in US but much in South Korea. And it is goddamn cutthroat.
Also, the few ones paid under retainer by aging billionaires, earning more than their equivalents.
South Korea might have more surgeons per capita, but it’s a small country. There are around 7500 cosmetic surgeons in the US and only around 2500 in South Korea. And again, you’re probably going to have a higher chance of being wealthy doing finance or working for one of the chaebols. Fellowships for something like cosmetic surgery are extremely competitive.
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I mean, better is subjective. As far as cost and time goes, not many fields beat medicine. A lot of doctors can have up to 18 years of higher education and specialty training, and none of it is generally paid for like other graduate programs. And again working hours vary from field to field, but I know some er doctors who work 60-70 hours a week.
Lastly my point wasn’t to whine about the pay, it was to illuminate that it isn’t the physicians or other healthcare providers that are primarily benifittting from increase of healthcare cost. If that’s what you took from the post, then you might just be projecting your feelings about your position in your own field.
Lastly my point wasn’t to whine about the pay, it was to illuminate that it isn’t the physicians or other healthcare providers that are primarily benifittting from increase of healthcare cost.
I guess reading comprehension isn’t one of the many fields they’ve got top PHDs in…
(Seriously, they probably need help and I hope they get it, the topical issues with getting proper healthcare notwithstanding)
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each of my postgraduate degrees is number one in my field
Your field has multiple “number one” post graduate degrees? Seems like that statement may conflict with itself.
how much regurgitation you do in that 18 years of “higher” education
It’s a linear education path, it’s not like you are going to have someone doing an orthopedic fellowship “regurgitate” information they learned in biochem.
long enough educating MDs to know what dipshits y’all are.
And I’m sure you won’t be willing to tell anyone what you taught these dipshit MD, or what your field of study is? Nothing what youve responded with gives me any confidence that you have any professional interaction with medicine.
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Let me guess, you also have a SUPER hot girlfriend, she just goes to a different school, so we don’t know her?
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So your tremors made you type out an incoherent sentence? Even if you had specified “fields”, your sentence still wouldn’t have made any sense.
And you still haven’t stated what you teach or your fields of study.
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I don’t see your doctor’s advocating and protesting for universal health care. You guys should be doing a lot of shit you ar not. Fucking backwards shit hole.
You also aren’t looking for it apparently? Physicians for National Healthcare Program is a group of over 20 thousand physicians advocating for a national healthcare program.
We’re not politicians, we don’t have anymore power than you do, and we are all in the same boat. My healthcare gets worse and more expensive every year as well. Plus, changing over to a medicare for all programs would save me dozens of hours of paperwork a week.
Most physicians under about 40 would love a socialized healthcare network. The people older than that are typically stuck in the “I did my time, now I want my reward mindset”. To get more people on board in the industry the largest hurdle would be lowering the cost of education, and doing away with the low wage residency programs that work you to the bone for nothing. Without addressing those while lowering wages, you’re basically asking providers to go into debt for the rest of their lives.
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i may have the teensiest bit of professional experience i’m not sharing.
Based on the rest of your comments in this thread, you may also be pulling shit out of your ass. So far, you’re giving the current US administration a run for its money in credibility.
I know a couple doctors and have worked for multiple clinics and got to roam the back offices, and your assertions are nothing like what I experienced, even if I don’t have 123 graduate degrees that are #1 in all fields or whatever.
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Lol, I’ve provided more credibility so far than you have. Keep telling us about the 9001 higher degrees you have
this is what you say to the public. behind closed doors
Everyone knows physicians get together to scheme about our public image as soon as we finish our notes for the day…
end of our field and i will have to retire because I don’t want all those fucking medicare patients."
The vast majority of money spent in healthcare is from Medicare. Pretty much everyone but odd boutique clinics gladly take Medicare patients. It’s not the 90s anymore, CMS reimbursement is often higher than private insurance and comes with a lot less paperwork.
may have the teensiest bit of professional experience i’m not sharing
I’m sure you know best.
And there are tens of thousands of other providers who do NOT want pay cuts.
Well, yeah. In their minds they sacrificed a lot of time, money, sweat, and tears to earn a salary that can reimburse them for their hundreds of thousands of debt and decades of little to no pay.
To fix medicine in America we are going to have to fix the education program. No other country pays physicians as much as the US, but no other country requires you to take out a fortune of loans to become a physician. The system is designed to pressure physicians into keeping the reward system going.
I think if we initiated a student loan forgiveness program and did away with a residency program that was or designed for a time when you were able to use cocaine to get you through your day… A lot more physicians would be on board than there already are.
I see how student loan forgiveness and lowering the cost of education would help, but what’s actually wrong with the residency progam that makes you say to scrap it rather than rase the pay? As someone who knows next to nothing, isn’t it basically just a was for medical students to gain some experience and turn theoretical knowledge into practical knowledge?
It’s supposed to be for them to gain experience and turn theoretical knowledge into practical, however it’s mainly used as a cheap form of labour. The students make next to nothing and are often working/on call for 80 hours a week.
They learn a lot, but past a certain point they aren’t retaining any knowledge, and worse can be dangerous to the patients. A lot of hospitals are basically run by mostly residents being guided by a handful of attending physicians.
Eh, there is a different department for that.
And they will bill him to death 5 minutes later, tops.
When my grandfather died, my mother had to block my dad from the front door because the goddamn billing department called LITERALLY 3 HOURS AFTER HE FUCKING DIED to know who would be taking care of the bill. He was ready to walk into their billing office and start swinging. So was I, but as a teenager there wasn’t much I could do without transportation…
When my grandfather died and my mom got a call about a bill, she was understandably upset. I told her that I’d take care of it. She handed me the phone and I asked how I could help. They told me they were calling concerning
${GRANDFATHER_NAME}. I interrupted and said, “hold on, lemme go get him,” and then muted the call and waited to see how long it would take them to hang up.
Before the pic loaded in, I continued the NIN lyric “and no one cares”
Turns out I was kinda correct
You should wait a week or two for it to really settle in, maybe try to send something after the funeral, just mark it “past due”.
No no. aim it for the actual funeral day if you’re going for maximum hit rate. Maybe get it hand delivered. With a brightly colored Uber eats coupon that advertises celebrations
Guys, hear me out: singing telegram.
Doctors never talk about costs.
That’s why hospitals pay administrators so much money.
they never talk about “hey, so let’s go over my formulary and see which of what you’re recommending is actually covered by my insurance”. they turn pale at that sentence
You have chosen to make being unpleasant the defining feature of what passes for a personality
I pity you.
try harder if you’re trying to hurt my feelings dude
The actual doctors are only getting a fraction of that.
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This? This is freedom. 🇺🇸 🦅 🎸🔥
i need to get out of here o_o
There are so many civilised countries that welcome the smart 'Muricans who want to get out
I’m aware, but it takes a lot of effort to immigrate, and executive function goes brrrrr
I have European citizenship, but I really like the idea of Canada (where I might be eligible for citizenship due to having a Canadian ancestor).
With american logic couldnt you say that their service didnt work cause your son died so you want a refund? /s
Enter suing for malpractice.
It’s interesting that the fourth panel is not just a copy/paste paste of the third with adjustments. They drew it. Neat
I appreciate actual art so much these days. The effort really does matter
We are SO sorry….we have someone who is going to come to talk to you about something
*Billing specialist enters room to explain the payment plans available
I’m too British to understand
Not for long
I’m too anywhere but the US to understand.
As a Canadian I too don’t understand the joke, eh?
You will understand it soon.
The doctors don’t do that it’s the responsibility of their employer.
“Sorry I don’t make the prices, I just benefit from them”
Not saying doctors don’t deserve a good wage, but they are absolutely aware of the unfair healthcare system in the United States. Could they band together and advocate for change? Yes, and some do. Should more? Probably. Do a lot of doctors not care cuz they’re rich anyway? Probably.
Some insightful comments on this topic made by @TranscendentalEmpire@lemmy.today earlier:
They really don’t, though. Doctors’ pay is just as stagnant as everyone else’s.
This varies a lot by specialty but many doctors would like to see less patients and would be open to be paid less to do so, so that they can take more time on each case.
There was a time (boomer era) where doctors owned practices and had meaningful leverage in the system. Now all of those practices have been bought out by private equity. Most doctors are employees and if they band together in any way the hospital administration has tools to stamp it out because this is America.
I’ve worked at several instiutions in the US where either doctors or nurses sought to unionize and through that effort institute safer patient care practices. The hospital administration stamped it out in every case. Even just the optics is challenging because if you make the suggestion of a strike they will run to the media and insinuate you’re betraying your oath and putting patients in danger. Many people are guilted out of participating.
There are somewhat successful unions in the country but if you’re in a region where there isn’t one, having a grassroots one succeed is very difficult.
Perhaps the most influential and lucrative specialties (neurosurgery, interventional cardiology, orthopedics) could move the needle if they didn’t have to spend all their time working but everyone else who isn’t an MBA administrator has unfortunately become a replacable cog in the system. This is the nature of American capitalism. It enshittifies everything.
A joke that basically just works on Americans… joke’s on them one might say.
